On guest blog duty today, no other than Alex Bain – one of Martin P’s famous posse.
All yours, Alex.
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Fifteen Championship managers have come and gone since David Wagner was appointed (or anointed) as City head coach, the latest two being Nigel Pearson and Gareth Ainsworth, with John Eustace, Neil Warnock, Chris Wilder and Gary Rowett all in the frame as their potential replacements.
If I were following one of our Martin’s musical themes, as far as City’s owners are concerned, they could be said to be currently turning a Blind Eye to all they see before them, while Simon & Garfunkel’s The Sound of Silence can be attributed to all those on the board.
Since the last three defeats much has been produced in the media around our octogenarian owners and the new partnership with Attanasio’s Norfolk Group, but barely a peep has emerged from the corridors of Carrow Road power. Even Mrs Webber has kept her head down and almost no one – not even their most fervent supporters – has jumped to the defence of Smith and Wynn-Jones.
Have they finally come to realise the futility of defending almost 30 years of waste?
Ambitious supporters who pay good money to be entertained home and away have been let down, and we now have a supposed handover period for an experienced sporting franchise owner and are told he is still learning about owning a football club from Smith and Jones – yet his expertise in data-driven recruitment is, we’re also being told, already being used.
So my question is, if this sporting expertise in recruitment is currently being used, then why does he need to be chaperoned for such a period? If indeed there is any need at all.
Is it to appease Smith and Jones? Why not just offer both a lifetime position as club ambassadors?
Right now it only makes him, them, and the club look foolish to the supporters and those outside the club.
When Attanasio was first introduced, he said that he was drawn to Norwich City as it was a community club and that he likes community involvement as well as openness with the media. He promised there was much more to come, but where has all that gone?
We are told The Norfolk Group has invested millions in buying shares and refinancing debts but nothing about ground improvements – ie. expansion and improved facilities. Are we seeing another Glazer-type ownership that takes fees and lets the infrastructure rot?
It’s early days, I agree, but the Glazers invested early to get a foothold in football and now have taken out more than they have put in. I just hope the Attanasios are not in the same league. Delia’s dream would come crashing down if Attanasio and his group were to take that same path.
Is that her fear? Otherwise, why the ultra-caution?
As things stand, the club is in a muddle both financially and on the playing side, and all due to lack of foresight and investment, and it lays at the doorstep of the Stowmarket pair – not the supporters or minor shareholders.
Urgent decisions need to be made with regard to both Stuart Webber and his wife needs to leave now, or else the new sporting director will have no chance to make his own mark.
Was he the only one to agree to work with the present regime and under his predecessor’s wife? If so, then the club has no chance of progressing out of this malaise.
Only time will tell I suppose if we can negotiate a way out of this current hell.
Spot on Alex, there’s no need for me to add anything at all to your observations. I’m fairly certain you would have read my recent comments and concerns over the Attanasio involvement, and bringing in a junior SD at this time. Poor sod hasn’t a chance, who undoubtedly will be under the guidance of one Zoe Webber – this woman has been the cause of much of the club’s woes these past couple of years or so. I think our club is heading into it’s worst period in its history
Thanks for the reply David C.
At 73 tears old and having supported the club since 1959 I never seen it in such a mess and there have been a few with bucket collections all around Norfolk to keep the club going.
This time unless Attanasio digs deep into his pockets sooner than later we will struggle to get out of this one.
Does Attanasio see this as a chance to turn a club around for a fast buck or a slow burning project with a little nudge here and there to turn its fortunes around only time and luck will tell.
With a lack of enterprise gumption from the Norwich hierarchy, we are walking into the abyss! Can’t they see, like anyone else that leaving the current situation hanging is not good for anyone. Throwing Wagner to the lions is a disgrace & needs to be addressed now!
Hi Glen
Thanks for the comment.
For nearly 30years we have stumbled from one problem to another due to self-funding, and its been the loyal supporters that have footed the bill, supported the revamp at Colney and yet the majority shareholders live in their ivory tower telling us she knows best.
Wasted years of little if any ground improvements, expansion to fund the self-financing model, no ambition to finance a period in the premiership which we were told was the plan for improvements at Carrow Road.
A few promotions followed by dire relegation battles and told it will be those short spells in the premiership that will allow the club to move forward in little steps when it should have been giant steps to hold on to the status quo not slide into the dark shadow of an enterprising owner of a Suffolk club.
Alex, I wholeheartedly agree that we need to hear something, anything, from Attanasio about his vision for the future and the way forward. Bearing respectfully to the past, and towards Delia and Michael, only gets you so far, and saying nothing leaves him vulnerable to being grouped as compliant with the former majority owners.
Where I would question you is upon your insistence that the executive director also has to be removed, simply on the basis of her marriage to the outgoing sporting director. Leaving aside the HR issues around this for one moment, it suggests that, in your opinion, she’s unsuitable for the position, yet you offer no substance to support your view. To imply that she will somehow have undue influence on the incoming sporting director, purely because of marital status, also questions the professionalism of her and the incoming sporting director. Ultimately, it’s in everyone’s interest for him to be successful and that will be the overriding goal for the club.
Hi Gary
Thanks for the reply.
In no way would I question the ladies’ professional abilities, but I just see it as a clean broom for the new SD with out shadows hanging over his every move.
I just think there could be a lot if second guessing when he tries to implement a change as in would Webber do it that way or will Mrs Webber approve his changes.
Only time will tell if the new man is his own man or a puppet for the boards protection
It’s simple not going to happen, no least for the HR reasons mentioned perviously.
.“Clean broom”, “shadows hanging over his every move”, “puppet for the board”, if that’s not questioning their respective abilities and professionalism, I don’t know what is.
You know more about what’s possible going on than most of us so will bow to your greater knowledge on what’s going or not going to happen.
Who has the senior position Mr or Mrs Webber ?
In my view its Mrs Webber but who knows as for her abilities being on the front line leaves her open for criticism on her preformance.
Mr webber has underperformed in his recruitment duties for at least 2 years at no other club would that be acceptable but with his wife being on the board who was going to sack him so a big conflict of interest.
Will Mrs Webber allow the new SD Mr Ben Knapper implement changes that will dismantle what her husband has setup this could be another conflict for her.
The Webbers have been a protection for Smith and Jones now half of that will be departing and the new SD will have to step into his shoes so besides learning a new job he will be expected to be the spokesperson for the board.
I’m really hoping that the new SD can over come all the hurdles that come with a new job and be a great success at city, he will either win or fall on the decisions he makes and I just hope they aren’t influenced by the Mrs Webber.
It’s perfectly fine to question any ladies’ abilities. You just can’t suggest it’s because she’s a lady. She doesn’t get a free pass and I have to say, what exactly is it that’s she’s doing so well?
We’re not performing on the pitch, we’re unstable off the pitch.
According to the club’s website her role is…
“Along with managing various areas of the club’s business, one of her key areas of focus is to ensure that everyone across the club is working towards the same vision and strategy. ”
Based on that, how is she succeeding in her role?
The Executive Director is no different to any other member of staff, in terms of performance reviews, we’re both agreed on that, but this isn’t what I was questioning, as you are well aware. It’s the author’s opinion that she should be removed because of her marriage, rather than performance. That’s complete nonsense.
In the last two years Stuart Webber has confronted and ridiculed the fans and alienated the media. He has also crippled the club with debt, shown a desire to leave, been absent during critical periods, and lacked the ability to provide a strategy or direction.
Zoe has a responsibility to the club, based on her role, to say Stuart’s behavior is at best unprofessional, at worst negligent and financially harming the club and damaging the brand.
What we heard is that whenever Stuart comes up Zoe leaves the room. It is irresponsible for one of the most senior executives to not offer a strong, damning opinion of his performance. Especially when there is no chairperson or obvious dissenting opinions among the board.
If she can not perform what is one of the most crucial parts of her role, as described, she should not be in the role.
No where have I inferred that she should be gone due to her being married so please don’t suggest that.
I have said there could be a conflict of interest and like many others who have said the same for quite some time.
I did say that both Webbers should leave to give the new SD a clear run with out having to look over his should.
And I have never suggested that the lady hasn’t done a good job as I don’t know enough about her to even think that.
You are sadly reading things things that aren’t in the article
Alex B, you have specifically said,
“Urgent decisions need to be made with regard to both Stuart Webber and his wife needs to leave now, or else the new sporting director will have no chance to make his own mark.”
Intentionally, or not, this implies it’s as a consequence of being married to the outgoing sporting director. If there’s other aspects of her performance that you are questioning, as David Bowers has responded, then that’s a different matter and you should have been more specific.
Hi David
Thanks for the comment.
At this present time and for the foreseeable future many questions will be asked of this lady and let’s hope the answers are forth coming.
Would anyone male or female in her position not have looked seriously at how the SD had preformed over the last couple of seasons and even more into how the Manager/coach had done in his tenure.
Neither of the Webbers seem to have taken responsibility for the situation the club and team is in yet they have overseen these problems with the majority shareholders but still no action is taken either to remedy it or assure the supporter’s that things will get better.
I wouldn’t be worried Alex about any criticism … most readers commenting here, like myself, agree with your critical observations, and whether married to S Webber or not Mrs Webber should be swept out along with him for reasons of not doing her job. She has overseen the mess this club is in, is culpable, and needs to be held accountable.
You’ve nailed it Alex, root and branch clearout is what’s required at NCFC. No point in just snipping away at the foliage, if you’ve got persistent weeds in your garden you’ve got to remove the lot to let the plants flourish. To continue the gardening theme, we’ve been plagued by the equivalent of Japanese Knotweed in our boardroom for too long now.
As for Sunday’s game, whatever happens I’m not going to join in any chants directed at David Wagner who I believe is a thoroughly decent bloke. Whilst he may have limitations (as do we all), like many before him he’s been used as the patsy to cover up the abject failings of those above him who promised a lot and delivered very little.
I take issue with the pundits who keep telling us we’ve got quality in this squad, apart from the obvious two or three saleable assets the squad is littered with journeymen who neither have the skill or backbone to get us out of this mess.
It’s a depressing thought for us long suffering fans but with the restrictions placed on the Attanasio involvement its difficult to see how this changes over the next few years whilst Delia and Michael continue to do their very best impressions of Emperor Nero.
Hi Bob
Thanks for the reply.
A clean sweep is the only way forward but there are too many that see it as a nice earner to let go and major surgery is needed at boardroom level.
Has Attanasio got the cajones to push them through or will he wait politely in the wings till Delia gives the nod.
The club can’t wait around for this handover period to be concluded and neither can Attanasio watch as his investment floats down the Wensum to league 1 or 2
Hi Alex, it’s not a question as to whether Attanasio has the cajones. I doubt very much you get to be as successful/rich as him without them. The correspondence I received as a shareholder regarding the recent vote concerning the share issue stated that he has to vote in tandem with Delia and Michael until the three years is up. That stops him from engaging in any sort of hostile takeover as far as I can see and presumably this was the only way they would allow his holding to increase to 40% in the first place.
That’s a big noose around his neck for sure, but is that legally binding, could he just disregard it and start buying up smaller stakes to increase his holding in the near future.
Hi Alex,
With yesterday’s god awful news still reverberating in my head I find it difficult to concentrate on matters NCFC, but I agree totally with your principle that a complete clear out would be the preferable course of action at Carrow Road.
But after reading the discussion on here I have to agree with Gary Field that Zoe Ward shouldn’t be made to leave Norwich City FC unless she wished to follow her husband by choice. I successfully worked with my wife for years and never showed her any favouritism, which I know she will agree with. Anything related to her I let my very able deputy deal with.
I think it is perfectly right that in a democracy we put forward our thoughts of how we see the Club run, but the minutiae we are discussing today reminds me of The Peoples Front of Judea ….what have the Romans ever done for us? etc meetings that will never have any outcome.
What matters for us as supporters isn’t if Zoe Ward is there or not, but who is chairman, owner, Sporting Director and coach.
With all due respect to other people and their roles at the football club to me they are of minor importance, not in the work they do but to the relevance to us supporters. And it can become personal.
I want Delia and Michael to go upstairs to be Life Presidents because they can no longer fund the club in todays age, we now have someone who can do a lot more potentially in that area in Mark Attanasio.
I want Stuart Webber to leave as I believe he has performed well in his role as Sporting Director for the first 2-3 years of his reign and he has performed dreadfully in the last 3 years. Look at the recruitment. And for his inability to keep good staff at the club.
I reluctantly want David Wagner removed as coach for the record of 6 wins in 20 games.
I do not do this because they are married or that I don’t like them, I do it because after the last 3 seasons it is clear that such steps are in the best interests of the club I love.
One thing the powers that be lose sight of it is now, counting this season FOUR years ( 2018/19) since us fans have seen a good season at Carrow Road.
Lets not forget the majority of fans saw nothing of the second Championship in 20/21 win due to covid. That is a lot of years of failure.
Hi Tim
I have never advocate Nrs Webber to be sacked just for the sake of it.
It’s more a point that she has reached the end of the road at city and needs like her husband a new challenge to recharge her batteries.
Another is a clean sweep is beeded and new ideas keeping a stale upper management doesn’t do anyone any good.
Thanks for the comment
I agree with you Alex in an ideal world we would have a complete clear out of the City board. That would include Zoe Ward.
What I was getting at Alex is we, on here were going down a rabbit hole of disagreeing on a very small issue that is highly unlikely to happen from pressure from us.,
Chairman/Owner (or woman) Sporting Director and Coach are the important roles for us the supporters. Again pressure from us on here for change at these top jobs alone won’t make it happen but the concerted effort from all elements of the NCFC fanbase can have an effect on things.
Also we must give Ben Knapper every chance, I for one believe if he get interference from anyone he should hand in his notice at the first sight of this.
Excellent article though.
Bob I love the gardening analogy – I had Japanese knotweed once, and had to move house to get rid of it – so there is a hint for Smith and Jones to leave.
Like you, I don’t think this squad is up to much bar Sara, Rowe and the young Fisher. We can do and must do better. Recruiting technical players for me is the number one issue for the new SD to tackle, hopefully we can get some good Arsenal youngsters in on loan or to buy. No more journeymen, please.
Alex, with a little crystal ball gazing, how do you see the structure of the board when the Norfolk group finally fully control the club and are majority shareholders. I don’t profess to know the answer but I wonder what people foresee as the ideal and what are realistic expectations for the club both on and off the field.
Regardless of the current position I hope Delia and Michael can release the club, allow it to breathe, join the modern era and progress but remain as life presidents.
Hi Andrew
My crystal ball is fogged up sorry to say.
The make up of the board for me should have a full time Chair Person over seeing the day to day running not an employee and her Husband.
The Trust should have at least one full time member with voting rights and maybe another with football experience to call on when needed.
But then most once the dust has settled will be from the Norfolk Group I would guess.
Thanks for the reply
You are deluded to think that 30 years of the club’s history has been wasted by The Smiths…..please point me in the direction of a club of our stature that has been stable for 30 years?!
Agreed we’ve badly list our way since the promotion of 2021 but 30 years c’mon! A lot of City fans need to get to grips with the club they claim to support and accept we have these transitions, it’s shite and no fun at the moment but if anybody really and truly believes in the dream of becoming a stable Premiership club then you follow the wrong club, accept what we are and roll with the punches. I want a change too as opportunities have been missed in the last few years but refuse to accept that Delia and Michael have given us 30 years of failure…. Very harsh.
Hi Jinx
We all have opinions and ours differ.
There’s no delusions for me just an honest opinion.
Could they have been more pragmatic in getting investment in to take the club further in my opinion yes but it’s been their way and they knew best and it coming back to haunt them.
Thanks for the comment
Hi Alex
Football is a game of opinions, highs and lows we all live it. Back on 2021 we had a multi million pound sponsorship deal on the table but fans didn’t want BK8 and scantily clad advertising associated with the club🙄 sr o dart transfer targets weee acquired and now we are here!! Ed want investment/sponsorship but it’s got to be nice clean money – Delia and Michael didn’t pile up and say ooooh we don’t like the sound of them- the fans did!!
I appreciate it’s just one example but that season back in 2021 was where any progress disappeared and this mess now is more a direct result of it, not 30 years of Smitj mis-management.
We DO need change and a reset and YES it’s time for the Smiths to step aside but it’s not 30 years of failure on their part. We have some very unrealistic ideals as a group of city fans these days and we need to reset too.
Cheers
To say that “the fans” were responsible for scuppering the BK8 sponsorship is wide of the mark. A section of the support made a lit of noise about it, much to the annoyance of webber. The majority weren’t actively involved in the furore.
Incidentally astom villa fans didn’t have any qualms about BK8.
The supporters who kicked off about this are more likely to be in favour of self funding and delia Smith anyway.
Really !
Yes😉
Smith and Jones have controlled the club with a vice like grip. They had investors before (Turners) who gave up with how D and M wanted to control things, then you had the guy who bought Coventry instead of NCFC as Delia didn’t like the sound of him – see what he’s done for Coventry, we could’ve had that. Why do you think everyone else has found investment and not us – until now? Even now after allowing the Attanasio group/family on board, Delia insists he needs to be shown how to run a football club when he’s far more successful than her.
It seems the only thing that grows at an alarming rate at NCFC are egos.
Hi Jane
A great comment and thanks for that.
Isn’t football an EGO driven game ?
It would appear that a final straw has broken the camels back. The self styled “custodians” will once again inflict the familiar pantomime upon us whereby they hang out yet another individual to act as a human shield.
At any other club in the land poor wagner would have been put out of his considerable misery yesterday so the short term goal pf steadying the ship by beating Blackburn could be planned for and achieved.
Instead wagner will take all the heat that should in reality be turned on those above him.
The club is in a terrible state, it’s been wrecked completely and the position of all those in the corridors of power is completely untenable.
How anybody could possibly defend any of them given the state of the club is literally bizarre. This cretinous cult of personality and slavish infatuation has to be rooted out.
The club needs a transfusion, new blood, new direction and new ideas. What it doesn’t need is selfish individuals hanging around with nothing positive to offer stinking the place out and dragging it further into the mire with their cadaverous inactivity.
The inability of the gang of four to read the room and haul arse is mind boggling.
In an ideal world on Sunday people will think before laying the blame at wagners door and harangue the true culprits
Hi Chris
Thanks for the comment and I agree with all your sentiments.
We have had some promising Managers/Coaches in the last 30 years that have floundered on the rocks of Self-Finacing and yet our esteemed majority shareholders can’t see the wood for the trees and none of their so called friends have enlightened them that they needed to move with the times.
The quote no one out there is interested was shot down by her own finance director it’s not self-finacing it’s self-preservation for them
Absolutely brilliant summary Chris !
Like you AlexB It has been a long,long time ago since I entered Carrow Rd as a wide eyed excited 10yo in 61/62. Seen first-hand many many up and downs. The barren years until Ron Saunders, the joy of John Bond, Kenny Brown, Mike Walker, Dave Stringer Paul Lambert, or should say Ian Culverhouse. Through the Farke era The slumps Grant, Gunn, Roeder , Deehan Megson, Rioch along with a host of stand-in’s. Finally here we are yet again on edge of another cliff just swaying before a hand to pull us away.
A quick look back over the very close to 26 years 11 month since the Stowmarket duo took the shares, from Watling’s generous offer. We have seen 20 managers/coaches, both permanent and temp sit in the hot seat. Compare that to West Ham have had only 17 in all their time as professional
There is leadership and stability for you. I would not care one iota about this sad Stat, if it wasn’t for the fact, that the same path has been walked time and time again, expecting a different outcome.
We all moaned like hell about Chase, that took absolute anger and demos to shift him, ( I got hit by a police horse on Carrow Rd, took weeks for the bruise to go) The main gripe was about Chase selling prized assets, namely best players, that is the reason Mike Walker left.
What the hell have The stowmarket duo done over the years ? Isn’t it the same ?
Here we watching yet another sale soon to be upon us of our better players. We wonder why we can not have a decent challenging team. Bruce Rioch cited a perceived lack of ambition at the club, main reason for his decision to resign, he also correctly predicted that the club’s star player Craig Bellamy would inevitably be sold. That was 23 years ago roughly, under this regime. The pattern continues… How right this experienced man was.
This Sunday a defeated man will be hung out on the line at Carrow Rd, yes Wagner has fulfilled exactly what I said would happen. But this is not all his fault, he is a decent guy and doesn’t deserve this treatment, of course he is a proud man and will not admit he has got it wrong, what other manager would ? Another nice man but played dire football of Chris Hughton, ebevn he stated he could have turned it round. I believe the only thing he could have turned around…was his car out of the car park..
This sunday reminds me of another past manager Nigel Worthington, who was past his sell-by date after some success, yet they allowed him to continue, despite the many protests, the Worthy Out campaign started by myself, a late mate along with several others. .He was sacked by almost immediately after a 4–1 defeat to Burnley on 1 October, a result that left the team 17th in the table and had been on TV. Yet he was not backed either. Is history going to repeat yet again ?
Sorry to have rambled on through a bit of history, I hope that shows the repetition we have had to suffer under the guidance of the Duo from Suffolk. I have said several times how I cringe and bite my tongue when I hear how well people think this club is run. None of these people bother to dig deeper or talk to the fans..
Yes there are other reason that could be added, but for me the lack of ambition, lack of investment in the playing squad are the main ones. The lack of money has been dressed up in a collar and tie called self-funding. I am sure they honestly believed it could work, but when the ordinary guy sitting on the terraces knew it would not and could not, surely the naivety is enormous.
Many look to the Norfolk Group to be our saviours, if they are…..Where Are You? Believing what you are told. Talk with some fans… It is needed now not 7 years away. I always maintained the Stowmarket duo would not let anyone into the haloed halls of the boardroom if they really threatened their place.
Hi Canarylad
Thanks for the reply and no rant just common good sense on the clubs current predicament.
It just seems to me that City have missed the boat in this funding/investment driven era.
We have a catchment area that has never truly been given a chance to take the club forward, there’s no other club within 40 Miles and if we were a fuxture in the premiership gates, could be bursting at the seems but lack of infrastructure ie capacity will hold us back.
Attanasio has a good track record in Baseball, taking a ‘small market team’ and turning them into perennial contenders with a smaller budget then most, he’s hired good managers so I don’t think he’s the issue here and to be honest I’d be more worried about Delia and co, scaring off the investment than anything else. I’m seeing the old guard holding on tooth and nail and telling Attanasio how thing ‘should be run’ rather than letting him come in and do the clear out we’re all begging for. The notion that they’re teaching him all he needs to know smacks of some staffers trying to escape the fact that they’ve outlived their usefulness and have driven us into this cul-de-sac because they just won’t get out of their own way. Wagner was the wrong choice from moment one, a last favour from his mate Webber before he slides out the door, I can understand some of the signings we made, cheap and cheerful to an extent so there aren’t massive wages and contract hanging over the squad when the reigns are transferred, but lets face it, they need to move this along before we see our new investors move on for an easier life at a club that wants and sppreciates the investment.
Hi Jeff
A good comment and thanks for the reply.
As I said in the article we need Attanasio to open up on his plans the silence is deafening is he or his Norfolk Group waiting on full approval from the FA if so what’s taking so long and why isn’t the club showing more effort in getting it approved.
The present regime seem happy to let things drift and that’s good for them but surely Attanasio must be getting hacked off with the slowness in how this is moving forward.
Are we seeing a little light at the end of a long tunnel or is that a back reflection from a small opening that could slam shut.
In answer to your headline Alex almost certainly yes we live in hope.
I think anyone who writes or posts on here all feels the same way , we can all see it from the outside looking in .
So surely those on the inside you would think can sense the same, the sort of living a lie.
But then Ostriches do like a bucket of sand god knows why .
Thanks for the comment
CanaryJim
Ostriches and sand is how I see it too.
I just read that Wagner can save his city future by benching the players underpreforming if he did that would we have 11 players to field a team let alone subs.
But we could also hope that we could bench an underperforming board
Alex, I feel City are a bit like an aeroplane circling an airport waiting to land. But we can’t , because the decision makers won’t make the call to make it happen.
We end up going round in circles.
Hi Bernie
I think you’re right and if what Bob says the Attanasios have agreed not to push for a takeover for the next 3 years then we really are in fir a rough ride.
Who in their right mind trys and buys a Football Club then agrees to not take full advantage of it fir 3 years.
It beggars belief that such a clause would stand up anywhere except at city.
Thanks fir the comment, mate.
Thanks Gary for posting my thoughts in a sad week for all MFW contributers either writers or commenter.
It got some great replies and many more than I expected
Thanks again
Don’t mention it, mate. Thanks for sending them across.